tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post3608615727503202827..comments2023-06-21T00:36:40.840-07:00Comments on Plead Ignorance: "Witch" Way to the Water?Robert the Skeptichttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comBlogger37125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-14452564141618683832011-08-22T13:31:45.414-07:002011-08-22T13:31:45.414-07:00Rain Yes, I understand... and I was just commentin...<b>Rain</b> Yes, I understand... and I was just commenting on the story. You are always welcome here.Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-28315842110442401872011-08-22T13:25:05.294-07:002011-08-22T13:25:05.294-07:00Incidentally on that ideomotor effect, I know peop...Incidentally on that ideomotor effect, I know people who used the ouija board and wanted me to operate one with them as they got rather into how it worked. I refused. I don't need to prove or disprove something that way but prefer to stay away from anyplace my subconscious might give me some messages I'd rather not have. The ones I know who did use the board didn't get the kind of messages I'd personally want.Rain Trueaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07994628226501093880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-13151917025614036532011-08-22T13:22:40.158-07:002011-08-22T13:22:40.158-07:00I wasn't putting it here as proof. Just anothe...I wasn't putting it here as proof. Just another story about it. I don't care if there is conclusive proof either way and won't put another such link here if you'd prefer not. It's neither here nor there to me and I haven't ever tried dowsing myself to test it. I would though, feel as she did, whether it worked or not, it's not psychic. It's just bodily awareness.Rain Trueaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07994628226501093880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-48274516214831357092011-08-22T12:50:08.187-07:002011-08-22T12:50:08.187-07:00Rain The movement of the rod, ouija board pointer,...<b>Rain</b> The movement of the rod, ouija board pointer, divining pendulum... anything held in the hand which "seemingly" responds to outward influences is called the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideomotor_effect" rel="nofollow"><b>Ideomotor effect</b></a>.<br /><br />So the dowsing rod moved when he got near the kitchen sink (where they would expect to find water). Wow, how amazing!! (LOL) An anecdote is NOT PROOF. What the article does not say is how many times he doused and FAILED, because nobody tracks the failures, on the successes.<br /><br />You should watch <a href="http://abc.go.com/watch/primetime-nightline-beyond-belief/SH55131205/VD55140044/psychic-power" rel="nofollow">this show</a> that recently appeared on "Primetime". It shows actual tests of psychics in controlled test conditions.. their hits, and more importantly, the MISSES that we tend to ignore. <br /><br />The appearance that something is connected does NOT mean there IS a connection. This is what makes magic and mentalism shows so fascinating. <br /><br />Here's the thing, if someone can bury 10 buckets in a field, 5 empty and 5 containing water, and this dowser in the article you linked to can find more than random chance with his rod, he can become an instant millionaire!! <a href="http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html" rel="nofollow">Here's how!</a>Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-80036178879591768442011-08-22T10:31:26.741-07:002011-08-22T10:31:26.741-07:00This morning, reading some of the blogs I tend to ...This morning, reading some of the blogs I tend to read, I came across this which applies to your subject here. This lady is no twinkie and pretty much only writes what she sees or observes with a very popular blog and no reason to lie about something. She pretty much came to the same conclusion I had for why it works for some people-- and not all.<br /><br /><a href="http://thepioneerwoman.com/blog/2011/08/witchin-wells/" rel="nofollow">Within' Wells</a>Rain Trueaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07994628226501093880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-26109424182011120242011-08-15T11:45:47.564-07:002011-08-15T11:45:47.564-07:00My water drinking is not accompanied by aspirin w...My water drinking is not accompanied by aspirin when it rids me of a headache ;)<br /><br />My only point with dowsing is not whether it works, which I have zero experience about, but that it doesn't have anything to do with psychic or spiritual abilities either way...Rain Trueaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07994628226501093880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-16533165557417127602011-08-14T21:38:48.339-07:002011-08-14T21:38:48.339-07:00Rain I've gotten rid of headaches by drinking ...<b>Rain</b> I've gotten rid of headaches by drinking water as well... mostly when using it to wash down a couple of Ibuprophan tablets.<br /><br />I'm not sure what the thread about fundamentalism is about so will just skip down to your last question about where to find a dowser: <a href="http://www.dowsers.org/about-asd/join-now" rel="nofollow">American Society of Dowsers.</a> <br /><br />Though I found this recommendation on a water well drilling company web site: <i>"The USGS (United States Geological Survey) has done much work in the area of researching and mapping of water resources through radar and satellite imagery... by drawing upon scientific knowledge and the drilling history of an area, we can usually make fairly accurate forecasts for drilling success."</i>Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-87297674295863254782011-08-14T19:13:31.900-07:002011-08-14T19:13:31.900-07:00You know I don't really care of dowsing works ...You know I don't really care of dowsing works and it was my husband's mother who discussed her ability to do this. She and I weren't particularly close, therefore I have no need to prove her right or wrong. Frankly these kinds of things mean nothing to me whether they work or do not. I have no evidence either way and it was coincidental why I got the email regarding it as I hadn't read this first nor discussed it with the person who wrote their experience.<br /><br />I've often gotten rid of headaches by drinking water; so a pear might well get rid of someone's headache and have a very real reason for it. <br /><br />The difference between a fundamentalist and those who are not is the need to prove others wrong. I don't much care what someone else believes until they try to thrust the result of their belief/disbelief onto me. I don't need to know that life is one way or another which I guess means I'm not a fundamentalist in anything but you know what, atheists can be... I go by the evidence (as I see it) for where things hurt others. I don't much see that atheists generally do and many religions can. I doubt believing in dowsing falls under that category though. IF I had to drill a well, I probably would not use a dowser as how would I find one? Advertise? *s*Rain Trueaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07994628226501093880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-43969147183472062062011-08-14T16:03:06.805-07:002011-08-14T16:03:06.805-07:00John Ahhh... but you see I ate TWO of them :)<b>John</b> Ahhh... but you see I ate TWO of them :)Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-28900630719805494662011-08-14T13:49:31.922-07:002011-08-14T13:49:31.922-07:00Put it another way, if my head ache goes away afte...<i>Put it another way, if my head ache goes away after I eat a pear, was it the pair that effected the cure or did it go away in spite of eating a pear?</i> <br /><br />That is a false dichotomy, sir. It was not the "pair." It as the "pear" that cured you. <br /><br />Run the test again.John Mystehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16263634313238599515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-81758638352442136892011-08-14T13:30:20.026-07:002011-08-14T13:30:20.026-07:00Rain Please understand I am not picking on you spe...<b>Rain</b> Please understand I am not picking on you specifically, we ALL are susceptible to this very common conclusion error of <b>confusing corelation with causation</b>. The appearance that something mystical is CAUSING the result just that... Only an appearance. We as humans are compelled to attepmt to draw conclusions where none may exist. It is normal and natural but it is wrong.<br /><br />Suppose your mother had instead picked up a rock, closed her eyes, turned around three times, tossed the rock over head then drilled for water wherever it landed! If water was found what would it prove? The fact That the supposedly dowsed well your friend spoike of had a higher flow rate does not mean the dowsing was the determining factor.<br /><br />Upon having then concluded that there must be causation, we then attempt to come up with an explanation - hence, your speculation about possible mineral content of the water or our ability to detect it, etc. <br /><br />But we don't even have to go that far - we FIRST have to test if the causation really exists. We set up controls over the conditions and variables, We repeat them and objectively tabulate the results. <br /><br />Repeated testing under controlled and observed conditions show dowsing returns results that are indistinguisable from drilling randomly by chance. Since it doesn't work, further conjectures about mineral content or mystical causes all become irrelevant, period!<br /><br />Put it another way, if my head ache goes away after I eat a pear, was it the pair that effected the cure or did it go away in spite of eating a pear? Testing is all we have, anecdotal "apparent" cause-effects are not reliable.Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-491661679034724422011-08-13T08:50:10.846-07:002011-08-13T08:50:10.846-07:00My mother-in-law, who had no interest in mysticism...My mother-in-law, who had no interest in mysticism of any sort, could dowse using a fresh peach or fruit branch and evidently did although I never saw her do it. <br /><br />I had just gotten an email from a friend where he said he swore by the system as he had one dowse his current well and got water at 81' a 35gpm well while neighbors who did not went down 200' for less flow. I have no idea of the validity of the dowsing as I have never found the wires moved for me and never had to drill a well although where we live, the water would be easy to get anywhere. We would need a dowser who could get water that didn't have high mineral content maybe ;) I would not see dowsing though as some spiritual system but maybe a sensitivity to an energy difference. I sure wouldn't think some god made it work if I believed in it.Rain Trueaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07994628226501093880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-27806634801409200562011-08-11T11:33:50.342-07:002011-08-11T11:33:50.342-07:00KleinsteMotte No, the grass and the irrigation sys...<b>KleinsteMotte</b> No, the grass and the irrigation system was in place prior to their killing and redoing the landscaping. They were likely roto-tilling and didn't want to till up the pipes. Yes, there probably is a better way to detect irrigation pipes.Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-52048674255842908662011-08-11T11:13:39.698-07:002011-08-11T11:13:39.698-07:00Well the part that gets me is why did they lay the...Well the part that gets me is why did they lay the dead grass before finding that old sprinkler system. And don't we have more modern equipment for detecting pipes and water? Maybe a sonoscope?<br />No self serves in your area? Lucky!!Heidrun Khokhar, KleinsteMottehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16174142810114806410noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-57738845507075535762011-08-08T21:59:46.695-07:002011-08-08T21:59:46.695-07:00Ahab Oh yes.. the woman who cuts my hair was ravin...<b>Ahab</b> Oh yes.. the woman who cuts my hair was raving about this great homeopathic remedy for insomnia.Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-51615229319159442022011-08-08T21:45:36.190-07:002011-08-08T21:45:36.190-07:00This kind of superstition still exists in our day ...This kind of superstition still exists in our day and age? I'm disappointed that people still believe this.Ahabhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14675629709031865432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-35053952925878196632011-08-07T13:40:55.939-07:002011-08-07T13:40:55.939-07:00SecretAgent It gets downright frightening when you...<b>SecretAgent</b> It gets downright frightening when you realize how that gullibility is channeled into the political arena - policies and people's lives they effect become at stake.Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-87966254237958729922011-08-07T12:40:56.816-07:002011-08-07T12:40:56.816-07:00It boggles the mind how very, very gullible people...It boggles the mind how very, very gullible people are.secret agent womanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03763879283931347382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-2743544082413024982011-08-07T11:55:02.889-07:002011-08-07T11:55:02.889-07:00John I must confess, it seems that half the time m...<b>John</b> I must confess, it seems that half the time my paranormal skills work and half the time they don't! A bit of cosmic intervention would be appreciated.Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-69362967750478000712011-08-06T22:05:31.612-07:002011-08-06T22:05:31.612-07:00I dowsed to my faucet and behold, there was water....I dowsed to my faucet and behold, there was water. <br /><br />I am going to say you as an untrained fellow, you are dowsing wrong. <br /><br />If you need help, let me know.John Mystehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16263634313238599515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-68706653027558439322011-08-06T15:20:36.843-07:002011-08-06T15:20:36.843-07:00Cryptos Well I have used the free utility "lo...<b>Cryptos</b> Well I have used the free utility "locator" service in Oregon. They come out and mark all the underground utilities, gas water, electric, phone, cable.. before you do any excavation project. Donno if they can detect underground PVC pipe. <br /><br />But I can't imaging a dowser being able to do so either.Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-89946377837948600502011-08-06T10:14:12.997-07:002011-08-06T10:14:12.997-07:00Seeing that would make me smile.
There must be a...Seeing that would make me smile. <br /><br />There must be a more effective, albeit less entertaining way to find pipes.;)Antares Cryptoshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12197876328401157462noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-54888834449745139062011-08-06T09:54:17.628-07:002011-08-06T09:54:17.628-07:00TechnoBabe They seemed to believe there was some l...<b>TechnoBabe</b> They seemed to believe there was some level of "technology" to their efforts. <br /><br /><b>Nance</b> I went to the link you provided and seriously thought about registering. Then I thought... nahhhh.Robert the Skeptichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10863488312604865183noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-86634992635154045782011-08-06T05:56:58.750-07:002011-08-06T05:56:58.750-07:00Brilliant entry, Robert! Way to locate a gem of a ...Brilliant entry, Robert! Way to locate a gem of a topic and mine it well.<br /><br />Now, on the church dowsers. First thought: Are you sh*ttin' me?! Second thought: Since not all turfscapers operate this way, we must consider their contractors. Must have consulted <a href="http://www.thejesuslist.com/" rel="nofollow">these guys</a> for a recommendation.Nancehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15166865250789996825noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8095807065479059898.post-25824582240139886382011-08-06T03:33:36.131-07:002011-08-06T03:33:36.131-07:00Heh heh, nice. Holes all over the yard. Doing away...Heh heh, nice. Holes all over the yard. Doing away with the spray paint showing the "exact" places. I would have enjoyed watching that play out.CiCihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08615265608675467505noreply@blogger.com